Comments on: Why Doesn’t WPF Support MDI? http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70 A blog Sat, 22 Nov 2008 11:04:06 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6 By: chuck http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-72380 chuck Sun, 29 Jun 2008 22:17:58 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-72380 I’ve been thinking for weeks on how to covert a line-of-business application that is MDI to non-MDI. I can’t think of a good way. I think this (http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70) post had only excuses you make when want to cover your bum. I didn’t see anything in it that was reasonable. It's 2008 now and MS doesn't have an example of MDI. I think the WPF Team didn’t do MDI because they didn’t know how to do it well. The WPF framework/model is not great at everything. Fine Control of Windows is one example. Of course the old Windows models weren’t that great either. You always had to do lots of API code and kludge arounds if you wanted to handle multiple monitors, figure out working areas when tool bars were involved, handle mulitple monitors position changes, handle changes in resolution, or center dialog boxes over a MDI window. You can kludge around with interop, but you still have the original MDI issues. I’ve been thinking for weeks on how to covert a line-of-business application that is MDI to non-MDI. I can’t think of a good way.

I think this (http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70) post had only excuses you make when want to cover your bum. I didn’t see anything in it that was reasonable. It’s 2008 now and MS doesn’t have an example of MDI.

I think the WPF Team didn’t do MDI because they didn’t know how to do it well. The WPF framework/model is not great at everything. Fine Control of Windows is one example.

Of course the old Windows models weren’t that great either. You always had to do lots of API code and kludge arounds if you wanted to handle multiple monitors, figure out working areas when tool bars were involved, handle mulitple monitors position changes, handle changes in resolution, or center dialog boxes over a MDI window. You can kludge around with interop, but you still have the original MDI issues.

]]> By: Jan Ku?era http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-63119 Jan Ku?era Tue, 27 May 2008 08:21:03 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-63119 Hello, this is one of the best post about MDI even nowadays. Well best would be to allow the MDI to be so extensible that the developer could choose/implement the behavior like Firefox or Excel. I'm not very big fan of interop, but I definitely would like to see real windows managed by OS as well. The docking/floating part is separate story (at least for the interop way), and there should by styling available to adjust the look of the tool windows. Also as rei mentioned, multiple monitors scenario should be supported, although I don't think MDI windows should be draggable out of the parent window (except the tool windows of course). Jan Hello, this is one of the best post about MDI even nowadays.
Well best would be to allow the MDI to be so extensible that the developer could choose/implement the behavior like Firefox or Excel.
I’m not very big fan of interop, but I definitely would like to see real windows managed by OS as well.

The docking/floating part is separate story (at least for the interop way), and there should by styling available to adjust the look of the tool windows. Also as rei mentioned, multiple monitors scenario should be supported, although I don’t think MDI windows should be draggable out of the parent window (except the tool windows of course).

Jan

]]> By: Tim Child http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-10793 Tim Child Tue, 10 Jul 2007 15:18:17 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-10793 I would really like to see some examples of a MDI interface particularly in the mould of a Visual Studio or Adobe Photoshop type interface (the latter in later versions is a particularly good example as it is multiple monitor friendly). I can see your reasons for leaving it out, but really think that we can have the best of both worlds and it should be up to the developer to decided what is best for their applications. I would really like to see some examples of a MDI interface particularly in the mould of a Visual Studio or Adobe Photoshop type interface (the latter in later versions is a particularly good example as it is multiple monitor friendly).

I can see your reasons for leaving it out, but really think that we can have the best of both worlds and it should be up to the developer to decided what is best for their applications.

]]> By: develop .net http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-466 develop .net Sun, 22 Oct 2006 18:02:59 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-466 <strong>Beta Experience セミナー「XAML 開発」...</strong> 木曜日は「Beta Experience セミナー」として「XAML 開発」の講師を担当しました。XAML（eXtensible Application Markup Language）は、Windows... Beta Experience セミナー「XAML 開発」…

木曜日は「Beta Experience セミナー」として「XAML 開発」の講師を担当しました。XAML（eXtensible Application Markup Language）は、Windows…

]]> By: Mac http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-465 Mac Thu, 18 May 2006 03:17:17 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-465 "If there is sufficient interest, I’d be very happy to write up a sample for current external bits showing #2 above — using Chris’s AvPad as a starting point, but really highlighting how to write the child window manager code. My only caveat is that this would happen after PDC." I'd sure be interested in seeing something like you discussed above. Thanks! “If there is sufficient interest, I’d be very happy to write up a sample for current external bits showing #2 above — using Chris’s AvPad as a starting point, but really highlighting how to write the child window manager code. My only caveat is that this would happen after PDC.”

I’d sure be interested in seeing something like you discussed above. Thanks!

]]> By: rei http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-464 rei Fri, 14 Apr 2006 03:36:37 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-464 If you ever do revive MDI, please make it more multiple monitor friendly :) That is, have it so that I can pull a window out of its container window. It'd be nice i I could read two pages of code on two monitors in the same instance of VS.NET. If you ever do revive MDI, please make it more multiple monitor friendly :)

That is, have it so that I can pull a window out of its container window. It’d be nice i I could read two pages of code on two monitors in the same instance of VS.NET.

]]> By: bonk http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-463 bonk Thu, 06 Oct 2005 14:52:31 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-463 Lauren, is the example already flying around somewhere? I would love to see how you would implement this MDI functionality. Im am currently looking into it too. Especially I am interetested in how to implement the visual studio like behavior where you can "tear off" a docked client window and make it show outside the parent window (without winforms interop). Lauren,

is the example already flying around somewhere? I would love to see how you would implement this MDI functionality. Im am currently looking into it too. Especially I am interetested in how to implement the visual studio like behavior where you can “tear off” a docked client window and make it show outside the parent window (without winforms interop).

]]> By: lauren http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-462 lauren Sat, 01 Oct 2005 01:09:34 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-462 Thanks for the feedback - and keep it coming if you have more. :) I'll put together a sample and post it in the coming weeks. Thanks for the feedback - and keep it coming if you have more. :) I’ll put together a sample and post it in the coming weeks.

]]> By: Keeron Modi http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-461 Keeron Modi Tue, 27 Sep 2005 05:49:08 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-461 Thanks for the post on explaining reasons for excluding MDI support (in Avalon). Would it possible to post a simple example of window management (as Robert mentions) or have (ChrisAn?) a version of AvPad posted that works with the latest bits (september CTP)? For legacy apps that are planning (speaking from experience) to migrate to this new technology (and benifit from using .NET instead of unmanaged C++), this will be really helpful. In our case it's a giant app with a backdrop of MDI windows. With the new Avalon framework MDI is the not the best of look/feel, but maintaining that support is really important. - Keeron Thanks for the post on explaining reasons for excluding MDI support (in Avalon). Would it possible to post a simple example of window management (as Robert mentions) or have (ChrisAn?) a version of AvPad posted that works with the latest bits (september CTP)?

For legacy apps that are planning (speaking from experience) to migrate to this new technology (and benifit from using .NET instead of unmanaged C++), this will be really helpful. In our case it’s a giant app with a backdrop of MDI windows. With the new Avalon framework MDI is the not the best of look/feel, but maintaining that support is really important.

- Keeron

]]> By: Robert Cannon http://laurenlavoie.com/avalon/70#comment-460 Robert Cannon Thu, 08 Sep 2005 18:51:57 +0000 http://laurenlavoie.com/?p=70#comment-460 Some kind of child window management is something that we will find important as we embark on an Avalon app (a decision that is waiting until after next week to be finalized). One thing that we don't want to see is the overlapping windows within a window. The designs we are playing with now feature an area where windows all "dock" to fill up the available space, but a window can be pulled out to float out of the main window. This is similar to the Visual Studio flavor, but with more than one "main" child window. I would like to see any code that you come up with as a guide to managing windows. Some kind of child window management is something that we will find important as we embark on an Avalon app (a decision that is waiting until after next week to be finalized). One thing that we don’t want to see is the overlapping windows within a window. The designs we are playing with now feature an area where windows all “dock” to fill up the available space, but a window can be pulled out to float out of the main window. This is similar to the Visual Studio flavor, but with more than one “main” child window.

I would like to see any code that you come up with as a guide to managing windows.

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